Ereptors Reign

[kell]

i prefer turbo to reg i find t far more interesting and enjoyable the reg. reg is so serious it's a game after all

[Gorak]

the nature of a competitive game is just that
competition!
meaning, everyone trying their best to win
not, I should back off, cause that guy isn't as good as me, and might give up if I whoop him

screw that!

we all start going easy, to make it easier for the noobs, what's the point in playing at all?

I say, everyone give it their all, and freely give some pointers to the noobs, so that they learn to be competitive on a competitive server.

no one went easy on me when I first started playing prom, yet I learned to hold my own

[TheSpaceman]

I don't know where this is all coming from, I'm not suggesting we take it easy on the noobs, i am suggesting we give them the option to escape it tho, if they wanna play with the big boys then they can take what they get given, But with 2/3d's of the land locked they cant even learn how to play. 

Ereptor may think hes making the game better, more competitive, and it is, its us trying desperately to save the game in the long run for EVERYONE.  If the new people cant learn, and the old guys all eventually leave, through time constraints, grow out of the game, etc, then where is our game, were is the skilled players to teach the new guys?  I can tell someone what to do but unless they can try it out the WON'T LEARN!

In the eyes of most EXPERIENCED RWL's, i wonder what the noobs take on it is, You guys cant say what they do or don't think.

If i was a noob id want to start slow and actually get somewhere, thus reg, more time to think between runs, my stuff don't dissapear each month etc.

And you can't say what they do or don't think, either. I cut my teeth on Turbo when it was introduced, after flailing around reg for a long time. It really is the learning ground, and I can't recommend it enough.

Oh and HOLBY I Can,

I AM A NOOB!!!!!!

Been playing for 2 months tops, EVER. I was trained to be as good as I am. Don't believe me you can ask WolfBite, but I can say that I prefer the idea of Reg.  I had a friend suggest Turbo, but I viewed it as more competitive, I wanted to do what little i thought I could to help take down Ereptor, and I didn't want what little i thought I could get given the state of the game to dissapear at the end of the month.

And All of that was only because I knew stuff from my friend about what was going on, If I didn't I still wouldv'e joined Reg, For many reasons, which I previously stated!

[Shadow]

2 months? Impressive. I'm sincerely glad to have you, new players rarely catch on as quickly as you did.

But I do like the way you imply in your post that ereptor's reign will last long enough to make the oldbies get sick of it and leave. I have more faith in the competition than that :)

[wolf bite]

The spaceman has asked that I verify he is a new player. I will verify personal information when asked by the person wanting the information released.

The Spaceman has only been here for a few months and his home computer does not show up under any of my tests as anything else.  His beginning strategies showed he was new. However I told The Spaceman that to not mislead anyone, I must disclose more information....

The Spaceman is Real Life Friends with a known Redwaller who had asked to train Spaceman on his own computer under the bro rules. Rarely do they still log into the game under the same account. The Spacemen is to the point that he will soon never need over the shoulder help and will be held to the same restrictions as everyone one. There is no conflict with his IP being his home computer on the forums.


Wolf Bite
(Admin Duties)

[TheSpaceman]

To further add to wolfbites post, i have been soloing for about a month and a half, only reason i still log on at my friends place is im like to constantly check on my stuff, im addicted to micromanagement in RWL. As of this moment, because i didn't think of it sooner, and because i didn't realise it kept me as 'in training' rather that 'trained', I am going to be holding myself to the same rules as the rest of you guys.  So no more bro rules for me wolf bite, don't need em!

2 months? Impressive. I'm sincerely glad to have you, new players rarely catch on as quickly as you did.

But I do like the way you imply in your post that ereptor's reign will last long enough to make the oldbies get sick of it and leave. I have more faith in the competition than that :)

It won't last, rest assured shadow, the takedown is coming.

[Gorak]

then what's the problem


you asked where all this was coming from
it comes from the fact that you are saying we should just give up on holding emperor because the land lock makes it challenging

you want the land, then bloody well take it! and stop the moaning

and you can learn perfectly fine on little land, infact, you learn better, cause you have to make the most of it

[TheSpaceman]

then what's the problem


you asked where all this was coming from
it comes from the fact that you are saying we should just give up on holding emperor because the land lock makes it challenging

you want the land, then bloody well take it! and stop the moaning

and you can learn perfectly fine on little land, infact, you learn better, cause you have to make the most of it

Just for you Gorak ill outline my position one more time, then I'm gonna just get back to the game, personally I think this has gone on long enough and we should just agree that we disagree.

1. Competition is good.
2. To be able to Emp is an admirable goal but to emp to the point that even good players scrounge for land is where i have the problem.
3. An extended Emp with locked land at ereptors levels is bad for the game, It means us doing the takedown need to take all the rest of the land, therefore those with no experience, starting from scratch, i.e. not me, have little or no land to try tactics.
4. If new people cant try tactics they can't get better and one day be as good as you guys.
5. Newbs learn on reg and not turbo, primarily because on the surface it seems easier.
6. For these reasons I am fighting ereptor, disagree if you will but thats my stance.

In a nutshell, competition good, emp good, land lock at extreme levels kills game.

[Shadow]

then what's the problem


you asked where all this was coming from
it comes from the fact that you are saying we should just give up on holding emperor because the land lock makes it challenging

you want the land, then bloody well take it! and stop the moaning

and you can learn perfectly fine on little land, infact, you learn better, cause you have to make the most of it

Just for you Gorak ill outline my position one more time, then I'm gonna just get back to the game, personally I think this has gone on long enough and we should just agree that we disagree.

1. Competition is good.
2. To be able to Emp is an admirable goal but to emp to the point that even good players scrounge for land is where i have the problem.
3. An extended Emp with locked land at ereptors levels is bad for the game, It means us doing the takedown need to take all the rest of the land, therefore those with no experience, starting from scratch, i.e. not me, have little or no land to try tactics.
4. If new people cant try tactics they can't get better and one day be as good as you guys.
5. Newbs learn on reg and not turbo, primarily because on the surface it seems easier.
6. For these reasons I am fighting ereptor, disagree if you will but thats my stance.

In a nutshell, competition good, emp good, land lock at extreme levels kills game.

Newbs learn just as well on any amount of land because they have no basis for comparison. Generally, new players tend to not attack much and freak out when people attack them, so initial land gain is small no matter how big the land base is. New people can try tactics just as well on any amount of land - strats are basically the same, just scaled up or down depending on how much land you end up with.

Also, I think that you are wrong about people learning on reg - I'd say it's about equal, BUT the new players who start out on turbo tend to be the ones that end up sticking around. Ones who start on reg get bored and leave quickly.

Ereptor's emping is the first interesting thing to happen to reg since League (<3). Peace and I emped briefly in between but with only two players and limited time it didn't last long.

To get as good as some of the oldbies here without a teacher takes ages. Years. Most of the people who are considered the good players have been around since the beginning (5 years?). A new player is not going to get that level of skill simply because he has more land to work with. To get really good, you have to learn to work with any conditions the game throws at you. As Gorak said, less land is sometimes a good thing because it forces you to be efficient with what you have.

All that said, we don't plan to stop emping. We invite everyone to join the fight, because that's what makes it fun, but we don't plan to stop.

Without meaning to sound overly condescending, having seen a few more emps and locks than you I can safely say that landlock does nothing but good for reg, and raises activity to levels that even turbo has a hard time getting. When League was in play, oldbies came out of the woodwork to join one side or the other, and reg doubled in size. We haven't seen as much of that yet with Ereptor, but if we last long enough, I think we will.


But I have a question for you: what exactly is the goal off reg, in your opinion? Is it net? Because without a reset, there can never be a winner. So temporary net is meaningless - eventually it gets taken down. We have had people claim to be emp just because they have had the most net for 10 days. BORING. The only goal, the only way you can say that you have won, completely and utterly, in a never ending game, is to take it over, shut it down, and sit on it until a reset happens. At least that's the way I see it. What about you?

[windhound]

...

1. Competition is good.
2. To be able to Emp is an admirable goal but to emp to the point that even good players scrounge for land is where i have the problem.
3. An extended Emp with locked land at ereptors levels is bad for the game, It means us doing the takedown need to take all the rest of the land, therefore those with no experience, starting from scratch, i.e. not me, have little or no land to try tactics.
4. If new people cant try tactics they can't get better and one day be as good as you guys.
5. Newbs learn on reg and not turbo, primarily because on the surface it seems easier.
6. For these reasons I am fighting ereptor, disagree if you will but thats my stance.

In a nutshell, competition good, emp good, land lock at extreme levels kills game.

1 - Yes.  Yes it is
2 - Yes and no.
Reg is not land starved.
Last run Sticker managed 100k acers easy.  Granted, he had two others scrape up land for him, but eh.  There's many players with 20k and above, that's a ton of land
And you'd be surprised at how evenly that 700 odd thousand acres Ereptor is sitting on spreads out
3 - An Emp gives a goal for the rest of the game.  Goals are good things, keeps people interested.  Its even better if the Emp has something worth taking, and land is one of the more valuable game resources.
4 - Go try your tactics on turbo if you need excess amounts of land.  Thus far my clan has opted not to lock land, although I believe we could.
5 - No?  See relevant posts.  Most newbies can read, and when they do they find they may have both a reg and turbo account. Basic math says more turns = more stuff that I can do!
6 - Good you're fighting, shame about the reasons.

[TheSpaceman]

To answer your question shadow, i think the goal of reg is whatever you want it to be.  Why do people play any game, because they enjoy it. People have their own goals. Some people want to quietly net, and if they can acheive that then they win, in their minds.  Some people wanna emp, and they win, in their minds.  Wining is in the eye of the beholder, when we take down ereptor, in my mind I will undoubtably think we won.

Now my turn to ask a question, you say that the noobs who start on turbo last and those that play reg don't.  You say they get bored on reg, my question is why in your opinion do they get bored, I n mine it is the sort of attitude that I perceive most of you guys to have, and I dont mean to be disrespectful, and please correct me if i'm wrong, but its what im picking up from this thread, and that attitude is that reg is not for learning, its for big boys only, and well always be here.

I respectfully disagree with that attitude.  No one will play forever, what is the abandon count up to now 900 odd?

Dont get me wrong, i have nothing wrong with emping, and i understand whats involved with that, but who can learn anything on 2k land? on 5k land? even on 10k land?  If i cant attack i cant learn how to attack better.  If i cant generate enough troops to defend myself, how can i learn to do it better.  There will always be someone stronger, an emp, or those helping him for example who can take what little i have, of course im going to leave, but only because there is no breathing room, no BALANCE in our game.

Oh and windhound, respectfully, last i checked you werent helping fight, I know you could be soloing, but either you have your own reasons to fight, in which case i ask you to share, or you have no reasons and can't criticise mine.

[windhound]

No one Few will play forever
Watch your absolutes, I take offense to them.

You're not very observant.
Take another look at the scores list.  Two hordes in the top 25 have less than 10k acers.  The average, excluding Ereptor, appears to be around 17k
17k is enough to be perfectly productive.  Attack some, get more land, and be more productive.  I really, honestly, do not see a landshortage in reg.
There's plenty of breathing room.  The emp is only one player.  I had no trouble finding land sources last run.  You had 80k on yours, so apparently you're not having trouble either.

Snowfish is active enough and has contributed when asked.  Given I just got her up and running properly a week or so ago, I do not see where your "you're not helping" is coming from.
The existence of Snowfish is not to gain net, so do not use that as your basis

Anyways.
Reg is slow.  One run every 3 or so days.   That's painfully slow.
People get bored of netting...  which, unless there's a clan war or an emp, is the default goal of Reg
Turbo you have a set goal:  to be the one at the top at the end of the month.   You also have full turns every day.  Turbo is generally more fun and active.
Reg has no such goal.  It has nothing proper to work towards.  An Emp is a good thing, it gives a solid goal.

[Holby]

To answer your question shadow, i think the goal of reg is whatever you want it to be.  Why do people play any game, because they enjoy it. People have their own goals. Some people want to quietly net, and if they can acheive that then they win, in their minds.  Some people wanna emp, and they win, in their minds.  Wining is in the eye of the beholder, when we take down ereptor, in my mind I will undoubtably think we won.

Winning is definitely in the eye of the beholder. For seasoned players, however, there is no challenge in netting, we have all done it with ease and without anyone to stop us. Being the top clan, or running a successful one has meant winning to me a few times. But at the end of the day, there is only one goal worth attempting, because it's the hardest- locking land.

Now my turn to ask a question, you say that the noobs who start on turbo last and those that play reg don't.  You say they get bored on reg, my question is why in your opinion do they get bored, I n mine it is the sort of attitude that I perceive most of you guys to have, and I dont mean to be disrespectful, and please correct me if i'm wrong, but its what im picking up from this thread, and that attitude is that reg is not for learning, its for big boys only, and well always be here.

I think the least of a new player's worries is how much land is around for them to take. When they sign up, they have 100 turns. They probably use them all at once, have no idea what they're doing, don't see much change, and never come back. If they come back, they still don't know what the structures do, what all the troops are for, why they can't attack people. It doesn't matter to them if someone has 700k land, they wouldn't know what to do with it anyway.

The available land means nothing to new players, what drives them away is the lack of turns, the slow rate of getting them, not understanding what they're doing, and no obvious support for them. Granted, that is a major issue with our game, so if any player asks for help, to compensate, there are a dozen of us willing to pounce on them to steer them.

Dont get me wrong, i have nothing wrong with emping, and i understand whats involved with that, but who can learn anything on 2k land? on 5k land? even on 10k land?  If i cant attack i cant learn how to attack better.  If i cant generate enough troops to defend myself, how can i learn to do it better.  There will always be someone stronger, an emp, or those helping him for example who can take what little i have, of course im going to leave, but only because there is no breathing room, no BALANCE in our game.

You will notice that the land spread between 2 and 30 (all the active players) is pretty much equal, the only excessive amount of land held is from Ereptor. Now last run, I scraped 100k land all by my lonesome. The land farm currently has 32k. New players don't normally attack many times, and the attacks they make are on people around them. To say there is no land available for our new players is kind of incorrect, I would say we impact the people we want to- those that collect as much land as possible.

I think it would be better to say this is frustrating you more than the players you crusade for- which is our intent.

[TheSpaceman]

Mabey it is frustrating me more holby, but only because i know what they could do and have and they don't.

One other interesting thing, as far as i can perceive is that its just you gorak and shadow mainly posting here, oh and lets not forget windhound. Other than me of course.  Mainly ereptors supporters. No offence but i would like to know what those on my side are thinking, get a bit of even-handed debate going, rather than just me and you three, and yes i know others have posted but as far as i can see its you three who are the main contributers.

Im only goin on memory tho, didnt check the thread, so sorry in advance to anyone else who is following and posting.

Im only going to say this once, when I talk bout land im talking bout land available to NOOBS sop basically land farm, unless theve gotten a leg up, and thats split how many ways?


And windhound, I can get 80k but ive been trained, a noob hasn't.  And don't take offence about you and snowfish, didn't i say you may be soloing?  And you still didnt explain your reasons. Criticising and not backing it up with reasons is offencive to me, just like absolutes are to you.

[Holby]

I find this "debate" kind of silly. It's not even worth my time elaborating on that.