Immortalized

[Devari]

 He didn't cheat, so why shouldn't he get his 1st?  :blink:

Naive, aren't I?

[Angst Vulpine]

 Yes, but his punishment from whatever he did last time is permanent, so he shouldn't be playing...

[sh0e]

 obviously angst that argument is not the real reason
and im tired of seeing that line thrown around when neither justifies nor explains what happened
bottom line; they dont like josh nor anyone who affiliates with him

its not a matter of right or wrong but rather of the iron fist; this is their server and their word is law
any argument of whether its right or wrong means nothing and has no reason to
if they want to impose censorship of all things josh
they can will and probably should

[Peace Alliance]

 Blah, I don't even think its worth starting this arguement again. Last time i brought this up we had little participation from the admins on the forum, and my lenthy discussions with retto over MSN didn't really get anywhere. The truth is that this is the their server, and they have every right to keep josh from playing. But the part that gets to me is that they're forcing the rest of us to take part in their constant struggle to ban the guy. They're the ones who insist he doesn't play, it shouldn't be our responsibility to make sure he doesn't too. because most of us don't mind him in the game.

We shouldn't be punished for not supporting a cause we don't agree with.

[wolf bite]

Well I see a good reason. First off, we don't know if he did cheat or not.  Nice guy or not, Josh has a reputation to be fast to cheat, multi, and exploit bugs to his benefit.  Unfortunately, no one ever knows for sure if he is playing fairly or not.  So it has to be assumed that he is not.

If someone gets aid from Josh, then they may be getting resources that was wrongfully obtained.

If someone sends aid to Josh so that josh can wrongfully attack others with multis, then they are aiding multis.

If someone attacks Josh?s enemies to weaken him or her so the enemy cannot take Josh?s land, then they are assisting Josh to be left with high land to exploit a resources bug.

I don?t see the difference between having your own multis or getting and giving aid to someone else?s multis.

With all the ways to hide a person?s identity and all the different people playing (many with siblings playing too) it is almost imposable to police the game nor should Retto have to spend hours each day trying to keep the game fair so that some a new person is not wiped out by cheating.  We want to keep a fair game that the best person wins! How can this happen when anyone can be wiped out if there are enough multis playing. (*remembers when an unknown ?wolf Bite? lost the emperorship in era II to 5 multi accounts of all leaders that murdered him over 200 times*).  

So yes, knowingly helping a banned player that is likely cheating should be punishable.


Wolf Bite

[Nohcnonk]

 Peace, if that's the case, it's Josh's fault, not Retto's.  Josh is the one that made the decision to cheat, knowing that the rules would not allow it and the admin would ban him.  Also, Retto and the rest have to uphold their rules.  If they didn't, anyone could cheat for one round, and say "Ok, I'm done cheating, I'll never do it again," or they might not get caught and win a round by cheating.  The admin need to have a harsh punishment to make sure that no one even tries to cheat.  They have rules for a reason, and it's most likely that the people than made the rules have a better reason for it than yours, which goes against it(no offense intented, just reasoning to the people that believe that Retto is wrong in uupholding the ban). .Josh's attitude isn't really changing either, even though he's not cheating right now.

Edit: Er, posted right after Wolf, dunno I repeated anything much. ^_^

[Wolf Snare]

 Ummm... Wolf, you are acting as if we were aiding some 5 accounts that did not exsist.
Why so confident that he was cheating? I mean, Isn't it entirely possible that he has given those bad habbits up and moved on? I believe that people deserve another chance.
He only multied because of shear boredom, anyways. ( I obviously know that cheating is cheating, so please don't inform me multiple times about it.)

In relation to the ban;
I believe that for Josh's wrongs, a month ban would have been plenty. A perma ban is just /NOT/ cool. (notice the emphasis on NOT)
I also believe that the ban is /totally/ biased, and that Retto just dislikes Josh. No, more like hates him.
Retto even edits Joshes posts, just to make himself look a bit better.
But meh. He isn't coming back. He is done with this place.


I don't think it is fair, but hey, what does my opinion matter. I'm just a small insignificant speck. I can't do anything about it , so just go and listen to your precious Retto.

The sad part is, Josh can't even defend himself properly, Retto edits his posts, then spreads garbage about him.

[wolf bite]

 How can you be sure he did not cheat?

Do you even know of why he was banned?


Wolf Bite

[Wolf Snare]

 Oh, I've heard ALL about it.
I've even dug up old topics in the past, and what not.

I'm not trying to offend anyone in saying any of this, but I am entitled to my own oppinion.

Oh, and I'm not saying he didn't cheat, because I cannot proove it. However, I'm just ensuring you that none of JOSHWINS was supporting multi accounts, or any of the other gibberish you came up with.

He pwned turbo. He didn't need to cheat.

I just wish everyone would stop believing everything they hear about him in this place.

Yeah , he did his fair share of breaking the rules, but with a biased opinion of what he did wrong thrown into the mix, the stories can get pretty tall.
Wolf, You know he isn't a bad guy , but not everyone who reads these things have had the chance to have a conversation with him.

All I'm ranting on about for is the fact that he can't defend himself. I figure somebody should.

Am I wrong for not thinking he is a total jerk?

[Peace Alliance]

 Josh deserved a hrfty ban. And nohc, i know it was his fault, i'm not saying he josh is innocent. What i am saying, however, is that everyone can redeem themselves.

Wolf, josh's perma-ban was more because of his inappropriatness. Not exactly because of his cheating, i know there was a LOT more to it then that.

Finally, i think the point i'm trying to get across, is that people who want josh to play, shouldn't be expected to turn him in. I know its a LOT of hard work for retto to try and keep him out of the game, and i'd love to help him, but i'm no admin, and i'm no rat.... more of a wildcat...  :D  

[Retto]

 Wolf Snare...how many times...about, do you think we should have kept letting Josh off the hook? A month ban here, a month ban there...

but then...wait, no, there's the month ban, the three month, the year ban for constantly trying to get around the bans, and that just goes on into infinity. Ignore that? Maybe, but then it wouldn't apply to ANYBODY. and if you had a ban on you, you could just get around it. Hey, why not? Nothing's going to happen to you, maybe it'll be blocked until you can get around it again, and even then you'll be off soon enough. So we can't just ignore the fact that every time he plays, it's been in violation of a ban - a month ban, a three month ban, a permaban.

You can say he's not a jerk, but I'd take issue with that, and say he's probably lying to you. I've seen him do that lots. You have to be forgiving enough for 200 people to put up with him for long.

Josh's permaban was because he really truly deserved a permaban, and because it would lend towards him not trying to get around it. He's /never/ coming back, and he can do /nothing/, and other people can do /nothing/ to lift that ban, and he should /just stop trying/.

[Nohcnonk]

 Word.

[Real Truth]

 Can any of you tell me the difference from reality and truth?

Reality is what is real, what's tangible, what is "proven"
Truth is an unchanging, steady variable, that requires faith to trust in.
Reality is what Retto and his tainted administration are experts at creating, letting everyone see what he wants you to.
Truth is what Retto has no real connection to, he enjoys living in his cyber world, where he is in control.
If I were unbanned, and he had to face the truth about what really happened back then, he would lose control, and his own self-persevering personality wouldn't allow this, too much pride.
Retto controls this server, it is his choice.  Half the things I was accused of I accepted responsibility for, but did not comit the act, I have cheated before, but not nearly as much or severely as Retto would like to say.  I know people who know the truth, who witnessed it first hand.  One of these people are Retto, who has access to in game IP's and the truth.  
Too bad he fears it so much, that he hides it, and in the end, destroys it.
I'm not going to go into about what a bad person he is, because of this.  I just wanted to tell everyone that I'm tired of his lies, and constant put downs, I don't deserve this, but in his world of almighty control, he feels I do.  
Insecurity and mistrust starts wars, Good triumphs in the end, it's not a fairytale perspective, it's all about the truth, and the truth is, more people are good than evil, more people are leaders than followers, more people will see the truth than the reality before them.  I trust in these people, I trust in myself.
I will not condemn this server, the only thing I wish was different about that turbo was that wolf bite had played his all, so I could beat his nw too(debatable)
Please dont make me come back Retto, stop the put downs for once and swallow your pride, you see the truth, dont hide it.

[Angst Vulpine]

Word.

That's my line. Stop stealing my catchphrases. :ph34r:

Growl. Some people just don't get it.  They just won't give up. How irritating. ;)  

[Ereptor]

 Wiser words were have never been spoken.  ( referring to Josh's post )