Is this REALLY nessessary?

[The Lady Shael]

 Whoa. Is it just me, or are those terms not banned anymore...they seemed to come out all right on almkman's post...

[edit]
[edit]

[EDIT] Wow. It did work.

[calria]

 Isn't it more that they've always been manually edited out when it comes to posts containing them?

[Abby The Rat]

 I edit them because I trusted people not to use them.

Right now, I'm tried and sleepy. I will take my say on this topic but I can't think right.

I'm really having trouble with this and I do try my best to make the forum a good place to be. And banning those terms because they were causing hurt in the forum.

I will say more later.

[The Lady Shael]

 *is very annoyed right now*

I sent a message to Ad about this, but I think I put a good argument in it, and so I'll post it here. Don't edit, Ad, because I'm not trying to stereotype, cause hurt, flame, annoy, or insult anyone when using those words in the below message, and no one will be either, I'm just providing an example.



While I understand you edited my testing post in the Discussion forum because of the two words I put in there, I really see no significant reason for doing that. I didn't write them to insult someone. No one was insulted by reading them. I was merely testing to see if the words would be censored out or not. I wasn't using them in a bad way, and now everyone will be wondering what in the world I was trying to say because it's an incomplete post.

I'd be happy to support you in helping out editing those words, but I'll only edit them if they're being used to insult someone or hurt another person's feelings, because that's the only time it's worth editing. Prohibiting the use of "those words" is like telling us to refrain from saying "attack" or "HPR".

So far, the only half-solid reason you've provided the rest of us with is that so no one will be insulted. Do you think anyone is being insulted? Do you think anyone cares at this point? This is ridiculous. There's nothing wrong with using words part of a normal Internet vocabulary for ordinary conversation use.

Only when someone says, "Stop being such a n*wbie." or "N*wbie's suck." THEN it's all right to edit them, especially when they're being used as stereotypes. But when someone says, "It's great to see so many n*wbies coming in." (something I've been DYING to say ever since without a censor ever since the beginning of this month), just read it. Do you see an insult? No. Is there a stereotype? No. Was it meant in a harmful context? No! And it's less irksome and more specific to say than "new people" or "beginners" which mean the exact same thing. You might as well just put a ban on the following: newbie, oldbie, old people, new people, expert, novice, beginner, starter, newcomer, master, experienced player, etc, etc, etc.

Have I gotten my point across yet?



Making the forum a good place to be includes making it an easy place to be. Too many rules and restrictions can suffocate us, and it gets to be a very boring place.

[EDIT] I'll take the liberty of my inability to sleep to add on and provide some more points.

Take a look at Lolita. She's new, just come to this forum. She's calling herself a n*wbie, and is puzzled when she reads the rules and doesn't know what she's done wrong. What's wrong? She's being deprived of being able to use a normal word in a normal circumstance in a normal post in a normal conversation with no intention of aiming the word at anyone except herself! But now, you've worried her. She's uneasy because she's felt she's done something terribly wrong, because she's pretty sure she hasn't. All she was trying to do was use a normal word in the normal way. She's very new here, and she feels guilty for something she shouldn't. Must this be the way all new people who come here be greeted?

[baska]

 Alright, I agree with Ju all the way, but come on guys, Give the admins a break! I mean without them, this place would suck! Thanks Admins.

[Dixie Ros?]

 Well said, Shael.

Okay..I believe that *ewbies should be alowd (I'm not awake, so that's not spell right,) ESPECIALY (Ack..Again..zzz.) if  you're calling yourself a 'ewbie.
Editing someone's first post is just wrong. ::cries::  

[calria]

 Well said, Shael.

As we all know, though, I refuse to disagree with Ad.

[TR Shadow]

 Nice one, Shael.  I'm glad some of the oldbi-- err...older members agree with me.  I expected to be the only one with this opinion so I'm pretty happy ^_^.  Thanks a lot!

Calria: Honestly, if the only reason you support this is because it was Ad's idea, then I don't want to hear it.

*Gets really bored and goes to find her old LOTR/RWL topic for something to do*

[Abby The Rat]

 Ok, now I have my sleep. Let me tell you WHY I deal with this rule so harshly and with the swearing rule and including the ban of the word D.

I have to been to forums in the past where, a word was banned. And the while I was there, there was debate to it, like we are having now. And the admin listen and allowed it. In the few weeks I saw this same forum go out of control and flame popped up all over the place. And the Admin had a hard time trying to stop this. I want to be SAFE. And not let this happen not slip once.

I want to keep this board a fun place to be and not get flamed at because you're new. Maybe I should of not been so harsh in editing her post but just PM her but I've only been an Admin for one or two months. And I learn new things each day.
I'm sorry in the harsh editting but I want to keep theses terms banned and no go out of control like it did at the forum I was once at.

I try.. I really do try.

[Dead Eye]

 I am going to say something many of you wont want to read about. I believe that when all the rules started getting added and getting additions, like n**** that some one came up to me. We had a discussion about it and in the end they said that because of the new admins and motds and the rules that were being made, RWL forum was becoming like Terrouge.

I will not say names nor point fingers. But I believe that some one also made an oppion like this, saying that the new RWL team was trying to base us off of Terrouge because they believed Terrouge was better and they wanted us better.

I completely disagree with the remark about trying to be like Terrouge. Ad is strict, but he is doing it for the good of RWL. I think he could take it down a notch, but he believes it will help the forum stay up. And I think we are better then Terrouge, not because i post here and this is like my home, but because RWL forums still are less strict. We can pretty much do what we like, as long as he doesnt hurt the forum. I mean, all Terrouge is about is redwall and rping. We have many sections in this forum about RWl but also we have the spam forum, generel discussion, redcon, many many things.

So what I am trying to say is that Ad and the others are not trying to get us angry. They are strict for the sake of keeping RWL forums alive. I believe that we should be able to say n*** because it is a nick name. Julie was right when saying that you could get around the word. Isn't that what we are trying to do with the swear words though. Instead of saying he** we can say heck. So theres my opion. Thank you!

[Dixie Ros?]

 *Goes nuts*

HOW do you flame with the word N-----??? It makes no sense.

I respect your choice, but leave ith des last words:

It's alowed (SPAG) on Terrouge. that says something.






(I needdddd sllleeeeeeeeeeppppppp...)

[calria]

 Julie: If you've been reading my posts prior to that last one, you know my other reasons. I didn't think I needed to reiterate myself.

Dixie: Yes, you can flame with that word. What happened was that at first we were simply debating about who was *that word* and who wasn't, and how did you define it... then, it became a sort of insult, as in a fight over we're-better-than-you-cuz-we've-been-here-longer vs. no-we're-better-cuz-we-do-better-in-the-game. Things got *very* nasty for a while... I think I'll go through the older stuff and see if the topics are still around, so that you, and others who weren't here during that time, can see how it was.
I know if you weren't there for it/weren't involved in the argument, it doesn't sound so bad, but I really thought RWL was about to explode from it all... Not that I was blameless... I was one of the most vehement of the we've-been-here-longer people.

[Dead Eye]

 Yea you definatly were Calria. I remember you always saying that only a few were older(other word though) and that everyone else was a n***

[calria]

 *nods*

Since then, I've realised just how dumb it really was... to sit and try to decide who's better than who just based on that is silly.
Doubley silly for me to sit there and do that, since A. I hadn't even bothered to get to know half the people I was degrading like that. and B. I'd be evil at everyone, and then go cry later (yes, really cry :blink:) because they didn't like me. (yeah... great logic there, I know.)

Since then I figured out that time on here doesn't matter very much, since we're supposed to be a community on here, and not fighting for "rank" like in the game, and that most people aren't going to like me anyway (so I don't worry about it so much anymore). *laughs*

[The Lady Shael]

 Everyone: Thanks for the comments. ^_^ I wrote that at 2:00 am last night, when I was in a particularly wordy mood which hasn't worn off.

There would be no other reason for me to argue on my current side of this controversy if I didn't think it would benefit RWL. I try, as hard as I can, to help this forum in all ways possible, and make it a happy place for people to enjoy themselves and have fun. Since this is Redwall: Warlords, most of us have a warlord-ish disposition, and arguments happen more than usual than on other forums.

While disagreeable some people may be, we have a lot of understanding and obedient people on this forum. When warned once, they'll try their hardest to follow those rules. Admittedly, they might make a slip a few times, but that's only human. I know, as long as you allow those words, that they won't be used for segregational purposes if said not to. If they are, editting it isn't a problem for me. I'd be happy to take on the challenge. I run through this forum twice a day with a fine-toothed comb (just an expression, of course) and if those words are being used in an insulting manner, I'll edit them. Not that hard. There won't be many people who will be liable to do that either. The forum you went probably had a larger member/admin ratio, meaning more members, and not enough admins and mods.

Not being able to use those words is severely annoying most of the members here, and confusing the newcomers. Raine left because of the ban on demi-curses. When you're restricted to a certain number of things you're supposed to do, it becomes very dull, and eventually, you can't even comment on the weather without the board censor or admins reprimanding you for flaming. While I understand you're worried about the future of RWL by allowing this, just remember, I am too. Be careful what you limit, and how far you go with rules.

And truthfully, troublemakers can be a good source of entertainment in the forums. No forum is complete without a rule-breaker, and being able to watch them being kicked out. Of course, too many rules, and in no time, everyone will be kicked out, and when you post a topic asking where everyone went, and no one answers, and you post again to bump it up to make sure someone sees it, you'd have to ban yourself for double posting.

We have a good deal of obedient people though, only every so often we get the Fenix/Mercenary/Kenny-type person to liven things up.

Note to everyone: See how I get when in an argument? I've been argument-deprived for a while, since Raine left, which is why all my steam seems to be blowing out on this one.