Terrorism. True or BS?

[Sevz]

Is it scientifically possible to vaporize 12 tonnes of steel with jetfuel?

[Shadow]

There is the impact to consider as well, and as was said, the other planes themselves (more than 12 tonnes) vaporized on impact. So yes, it is, when the energy of the crash is considered in addition to the burning afterward.

[Sevz]

That doesn't explain why 2planes were jus chilling in the top of a building after the same impact as the 2 planes that crashed and turned into nothing.

Why did tower 7 collapse in the same manner as tower 1 and 2 when there was no plane that hit it? Not possible if Impact+heat is your answer.

[Shadow]

That doesn't explain why 2planes were jus chilling in the top of a building after the same impact as the 2 planes that crashed and turned into nothing.

Well yes it does - hitting the ground is very different from hitting a tower - there is less stuff to smash into in a tower than on solid ground. You can't compare the two impacts directly, you would have to correct for the material they landed in.

As the North Tower collapsed on September 11, 2001, heavy debris hit 7 World Trade Center, causing damage to the south face of the building.[4]  The bottom portion of the building's south face was damaged by debris, including damage to the southwest corner from the 8th to 18th floors, a large vertical gash on the center-bottom extending at least ten floors, and other damage as high as the 18th floor.

A massive fire burned into the afternoon on the 11th and 12th floors of 7 World Trade Center, the flames visible on the east side of the building.[30][31]  During the afternoon, fire was also seen on floors 6â€"10, 13â€"14, 19â€"22, and 29â€"30.[4]  In particular, the fires on floors 7 through 9 and 11 through 13 continued to burn out of control during the afternoon.[32]  At approximately 2:00 p.m., firefighters noticed a bulge in the southwest corner of 7 World Trade Center between the 10th and 13th floors, a sign that the building was unstable and might collapse.[33]  During the afternoon, firefighters also heard creaking sounds coming from the building.[34]  Around 3:30 pm FDNY Chief Daniel Nigro decided to halt rescue operations, surface removal, and searches along the surface of the debris near 7 World Trade Center and evacuate the area due to concerns for the safety of personnel.[35]  At 5:20:33 p.m. EDT on September 11, 2001, 7 World Trade Center started to collapse, with the crumble of the east mechanical penthouse, while at 5:21:10 p.m. EDT the entire building collapsed completely

That process was far too drawn out for a demolition - demolitions don't take hours. You'll also notice that the collapse began near the top of the tower, rather than the bottom according to this.

[Juska]

10 replies since I started watching the video, wow.

Anyway, I watched from minute 32 to minute 1:13.

This is incredibly interesting and shows very strong evidence for 9/11 paving the way for increased U.S. Imperialism.

Part III on banking is even better and I think very probable.

I don't have time to watch the whole movie right now unfortunately, but I will soon. I might even show this to my floor as a program.

Wolf Snare and Sevz you agree pretty much wholly with what this video says?

Thank you very much for posting that.

If anything, what this video says reiterates the fact that large government is the enemy of the people.

[Shadow]

very strong evidence for 9/11 paving the way for increased U.S. Imperialism.

Was there ever even a question of doubting that? ^_^

I think you missed the part that ripped on organized religion, Juska, I would watch that too before you start saying you agree wholly with the video.

[Juska]

Shadow you have a problem with ever actually reading my posts.

I never said I wholly agreed with the video, I asked if Wolf Snare and Sevz did. If you read my post you'll see that I haven't watched it in entirety. I look forward to hearing what they have to say of organized religion though, I think your very stereotypical in your viewing of me and people in general.

[Wolf Snare]

Shadow, the common factors they found between religious figures dating back 3000 years is irrelevent and I intentionally told him to start watching at part two, which is what this topic is discussing. I know Juska is religous and knew it would throw off the rest of the video for him... You seem keen to do that anyways.

Just so you know, there were no bodies, or any evidence whatsoever of the planes that crashed in Pennsylvania or the Penagon, and the FBI sealed off both areas until they could cover it up. This is extremely unlikely to not have found one peice of steel or an arm; there's basically no evidence of either of those planes.

[Sevz]

I was under the impression there was no real enemy from day 1. It looked like an excuse to steal oil.
And Juska, you should check out the Addendum edition.

I think Shadow has more interest in proving us wrong on a personal level than debating his honest thoughts.

My favorite 2 parts are when the guy is yelling, You think people in a cave made Norad stand down? You think People in a cave did all this?

The other part is.
In the year 2000 Norad had 67 intercepts at 100% accuracy.
on 9/11 they failed 4times in 1day.

[Shadow]

I know Juska is religous and knew it would throw off the rest of the video for him... You seem keen to do that anyways.

No, I quite liked the bits of the video that I saw, I was just pointing him in the direction of the part he did not see.

I think your very stereotypical in your viewing of me and people in general.

I read it, and I saw that you hadn't watched the first part and suggested that you did. Knowing that you are religious, I assumed that you woul find argument with it. What is the problem?

Just so you know, there were no bodies, or any evidence whatsoever of the planes that crashed in Pennsylvania or the Penagon, and the FBI sealed off both areas until they could cover it up. This is extremely unlikely to not have found one peice of steel or an arm; there's basically no evidence of either of those planes.

Or they just cleaned it up and didn't see the need to open up the wreckage for public viewing?

I think Shadow has more interest in proving us wrong on a personal level than debating his honest thoughts.

Everything I have said is based on science and logic. How is any of what I have said about this personal or dishonest?

[Sevz]

Sometimes it's better to accept the truth rather than argue. You'd rather be proven wrong than agree.

Everyone likes Zeitgeist. It's the answers we all know deep down but can't prove.

[Shadow]

Sometimes it's better to accept the truth rather than argue. You'd rather be proven wrong than agree.

I won't agree with something or believe something until I see some evidence for it. And I have seen nothing in this that points directly to an inside job. There are some things are COULD point in that direction if taken out of context, but overall there is nothing directly linking things.

I'd rather be proven wrong than agree about something, because if I was proven wrong it would mean that concrete evidence had been provided. In which case I would stop arguing. It's quite a simple process.

[Holby]

Zeitgeist is fairly enjoyable to watch. Especially the religious bit  ;) .

The problem is that there is always "overwhelming" evidence that something happened for a reason that's not the commonly believed one. People love conspiracies. I think Zeitgeist makes some interesting points, but I take it all with a grain of salt. It's no more balanced than a Michael Moore doco.

I think it would be very unwise to take Zeitgeist as proof. If you look for conspiracies, aliens and government corruption on the Internet, you will find millions and millions of websites to support your views. That doesn't make them any more accurate.

[Shadow]

I think Shadow has more interest in proving us wrong on a personal level than debating his honest thoughts.

Everything I have said is based on science and logic. How is any of what I have said about this personal or dishonest?

I'd still like an answer to this

[Gorak]

I'm with Holby
I have Zeitgeist, have had it for awhile
it makes alot of interesting points, but still doesn't offer anything concrete to support their conspiresy
it is far from fact

at best they show their conspirecy to be somewhat plausable, not proven

again, we don't know, the guys who made the movie, don't know
it's all just digging to find things to support a theory, not basing a theory on what evidence was found
all these conspirecy theory "docs" about 9/11 lack objectivity

I fear we may never actually know what happened and why in our lifetime