Vacation

[Gen. Volkov]

I like Shadow's suggestion the best, Marell's the second best. Briar, I think your suggestion of two different colors would lead to the person going on vaca getting hammered harder than they would otherwise. The extended limit shouldn't worry those going on vaca for legit reason, as nothing would happen in that time that wouldn't have happened otherwise. Limiting the number of attacks during an extended period still gives the opportunity for abuse though.

[Blood Wake]

to anyone who is wondering about Aust (#22)

Sean says:
hey

Sean says:
who are you? are you Aust on Turbo?

Aust says:
sup

Aust says:
yeah im aust

Sean says:
I know I know you, and I like you. but I have a horrible memory

Sean says:
lol

Aust says:
lol

Sean says:
so what's up?

Aust says:
not much, on vacation for memorial day at my aunts lol didnt know she got a computer lol

Sean says:
Hahaha

Sean says:
that's funny

Aust says:
now i wish i wouldnt have went on vac in turb o

Sean says:
lol, I see. you've read stuff on the forums haven't you?

Aust says:
what stuff? my account on forums got deleted a while ago from inactivity

Aust says:
on forums*

Sean says:
I see

Aust says:
i rarely get on forums last time i was on there a half month ago i tried to log on and it said my account didnt exist

Sean says:
well if you haven't heard, everyone is very upset at Allendale for going on vacation with 18 bil networth

Aust says:
wow 18 bill

Sean says:
people are kind of upset with you too, but they shouldn't be

Sean says:
yeah, he was rank 1 of course and Watchtower, which I'm a member of, would be able to take him down except that he took the cowards way out and went on vacation even though he's still been getting online

Aust says:
well when i went on vac i store housed all my stuff, so my nw shouldnt be that high, does the store house still give people vacationed stuff?

Sean says:
hmm... well you must have gotten troops and stuff when the distribution happened right before you were officially on vacation, cause you were high in the ranks

Sean says:
45 ? Aust (#22) 6,029 $3,914,573,389 None Marten Southsward

Aust says:
huh thought the store house wouldnt give me stuff, i shoul dhave left the clan, but i didnt think about it at the time i was in a rush to leave

Sean says:
hmm, that's quite funny

Aust says:
ah well my vac ends in 2 days and since my aunt has a computer i can get out of it as soon as it ends

Sean says:
cool

Sean says:
well if you don't mind I think I'll put this convo on the forums so that anyone who is upset with you for any reason will hear your story

Aust says:
thank you

Sean says:
yup yup

[Gen. Volkov]

A lot of talk here that I think is silly. I believe we all agree the vacation move was cheap. Even if windy claims he's legitimately busy, he would acknowledge that the timing of his vacation-setting was a cheap way to play the game.

It's code abuse Peace, the vacation function was not intended to be used this way.

But people are allowed to play this game as cowards, just as they are allowed to play with honor. The only time code should be implemented to stop it is when there is an exploit found, or when something is ruining the game

This is a fairly isolated incident, probably one we won't have to worry about until the next storehouse round. There is a solution we could put right into the storehouse theme. That would be to force all vacationers out of vaca 3 days before the reset...

.

It's happened at least once before, and was gotten away with, now it's happened again, and will presumably keep happening until it is stopped. It could easily ruin the game. Allendale can come out of vaca 1 hour or even 1 minute before the reset, and "win", if the other members of Guy destroy Watchtowers net in the meantime. It's not cowardice, it's exploiting the code. They could do it in a regular round of Turbo as well. Build up to a certain point, stick it all on one guy, who gets booted and goes on vaca, then spend the rest of the round keeping the opposition suppressed. Then their guy comes out of vaca right before the reset, and boom, instant "win". Heck, I thought of it myself a while back, but decided it was code abuse and didn't do it. If I'm gonna win, I'm gonna do it without cheating or not at all.

Or... You could just remember what bob and company has done this round, and give them a harder time at doing it next round.

Why should we have to keep watch on these guys every round as they exploit the code? We shouldn't have too.

to anyone who is wondering about Aust (#22)

Thanks for the update Sean. If they both come out of vaca after Memorial day weekend, fine, they aren't cheating, just treading a very fine line. In any event though, the opportunity to abuse the code like this should be removed.

[windhound]

Windy - just because your net got destroyed last time is not reason to go on vaca this time. Too [darn] bad. If you can't defend your net until the end of the set, you don't deserve to keep it, and your win counts for nothing in everybody's eyes but your own. And since you have posted here, the holiday crap doesn't work either - you have access to a computer, therefore your vacation is unnecessary in that sense.

Bull.
And anyways, for the hundredth time this isn't my net.  Maybe a billion of it is, no more.  I was fully prepared to defend -my- net.
I really hate how much you love to assume.  It makes donkeys outta you, but not so much me.  I made the post maybe an hour or two after the distribution.  Is there a law that I -must- put my account on vacation the very moment before I leave on a trip?  I was gone all last night and all of today.  I'll be gone the vast majority of tomorrow and monday is up in the air.  I, in short, do not have the time for Turbo right now.
Back Off.

[Shadow]

Then you should not have agreed to hold that net. Your vacation is for defense. You are still arguing, which means you have the 10 minutes a day it takes to run. If you can;t play, don't get involved like you are. And if you get involved, don't claim inability to play.

Peace - people are allowed to play like cowards within the context of the rules. Making your net completely invincible is not explicitly forbidden, but is against the spirit of the rules. As a comparison, there is no law in Canada against identity theft - does that make it acceptable?

We should not have to police the actions of other players. This is the third time to date that vacation has been abused for the purposes of defense. Something needs to be done, and the fix is easy - just get rid of voluntary vacation and let the autovacation feature take care of truly inactive accounts.

[Briar]

So, in other words, say your solution was already in place, would that mean that you would have been ok with people not logging into their account for a week before distro and then having themselves be  put in vacation holding the net?

If yes, then that's fine.  I'm just pointing out that there is a possibility for "abuse" still.

[windhound]

Dont play dumb Shadow, it doesnt suit you.
Turbo at the moment requires more than 10 min per day if you're defending net.

I refuse to believe there's no laws against identity theft in Canada
http://www.gov.on.ca/mgs/en/ConsProt/STEL02_045992.html  infact, it looks pretty illegal to me

Identity theft occurs when someone uses your personal information without your knowledge or consent to commit a crime, such as fraud or theft.

You may want to learn your own country's laws a bit better

A better comparison is Leader Suicides.  It was never intended, as written, for leader attacks to be used as they are being used now.  Its an exploit by that terminology and anyone doing so should be temp-banned.

Vacation is still a necessary part of the game.
Your version is still exploitable, as Briar said.  You just designate a holder and send them everything 10 min before vacation hits.

[Peace Alliance]

OK windy, I'm sure you don't have YOU'RE criminal code memorized either...

Can we avoid making this personal?

You're suggesting making it so it takes 7 days to go on vacation instead of 12 hours. I would prefer a more subtle solution. I also don't see this as such a huge problem. It is really annoying in this instance, especially because of the theme. But it has only been a moderate nuisance when used on reg. Bob was hiding from a fight; the advantage it gained him was minimal. In the end it didn't even help his cause.

[Shadow]

About ID theft - That link says nothing about it being illegal, only defines it. There are ads all over Ottawa saying that there are no specific laws against ID theft. So while it is a crime, there is no way to prosecute it in court at the moment except in a few specific cases. Same with this vacation thing. It isn't specifically forgidden by the rules at the moment, so people abuse it and cite the letter of the rules.

Canadian Criminal Code
While in Canada there is no generalized offence called identity theft, there are a number of offences in the Criminal Code that criminalize activities integral to the criminal misuse of personal information. For example, subsection 342(3) of the Criminal Code criminalizes the possession, use of or trafficking in credit card and debit card data in such a way that would allow the perpetrator to use either the credit card or debit card itself or to obtain the services provided by the issuer of the card. The forgery provisions apply to persons who make false documents, with knowledge that the documents are false, and with intent that they should be used or acted on as genuine. A person who actually uses a false document, knowing that the document is forged, to defraud another person can be charged with fraud and with uttering a forged document. Perpetrators who assume a false identity in order to gain an economic or other advantage (such as to avoid detection for criminal offences) can be charged with personation. These provisions are illustrative of a number of the current provisions in the Criminal Code that address various aspects of identity theft.

Bit of irrelevent background.

Maybe not a full week for vacation to kick in on turbo - maybe more like 3 days for turbo and a week for reg. The important point is that people not be allowed to voluntarily vacation - if people are really on vacation, it will happen by itself.

Leader suicides are a problem in tha they are too strong, but getting rid of them would unbalance the game waaay too much in favor of leader players. They may not have been intentional, but they are an example of a GOOD unintentional use of code, one that balances the game. A code hole that leaves the most net in the game completely untouchable is not a balanced one.

Now I realize that as soon as this weekend is over you are going to take that account off vacation and tell me how wrong it is to jump to comclusions, but the point remains that the vacation feature has ruined a fine opportunity for a takedown, and the person in question is very obviously not on vacation.

Now I am very curious to see if you can rejoin a clan after 3 days on vacation - if you can, then there is another loophole that needs plugging.

[Zeppelin]

hey calm down everyone. i dont appreiate being onlined and according to rook it was an option he asked about. the only reason i was leader of guy for so long is because i made it first. but ya u guys onlined me like a hundred times and killed me twice and refused to do battle the way normal promis work so i got no respect for ur skill. now then if u stop being a code exploiting joke and killing me and leader attacking everyone down ( i dont think anyone who was in my clan does either) then id be happy to respect u and have a war where ur not hypocritical. u planned to kill me the entire time i planned to do the skillbased thing and use my troops to break yours. kills are fine but htats not the point i came here to try to get away from some of the kills that always happened.

[Firetooth]

ur typing is hard 2 read. can u type proper plz? i got no respect for ur typing srry
I know your leader of guy, but meh, not something I'd be proud of personally. Maybe if your into code abuse, but otherwise...Still, I symphazize with you on the kill thing, it's dirty, but heck so is going on to vaca with 18bil net.

[Zeppelin]

ur typing is hard 2 read. can u type proper plz? i got no respect for ur typing srry
I know your leader of guy, but meh, not something I'd be proud of personally. Maybe if your into code abuse, but otherwise...Still, I symphazize with you on the kill thing, it's dirty, but heck so is going on to vaca with 18bil net.

i was killed twice for nothing so its not like it can even be justified i dont really care then because i think that frquent kills are code abuse. i was killed before anyone went in vacation too but i was surprised to hear aust went too i thought he was going to stay around and hoped hed log in before ppl abused leaders on him.now then can we agree on a proper duel?

[Firetooth]

"Duel?" This isn't the west lol.
Maybe we'd give you a "duel" if you hadn't vaca'd 18bil net. That is code abuse. Killing is dirty, but not code abuse.
Maybe the fact you spied on watchtower is why you were killed? And you wonder why you were killed.

[Zeppelin]

"Duel?" This isn't the west lol.
Maybe we'd give you a "duel" if you hadn't vaca'd 18bil net. That is code abuse. Killing is dirty, but not code abuse.
Maybe the fact you spied on watchtower is why you were killed? And you wonder why you were killed.

i didnt spy on watcchtower u just never screened who u let in. thats wathtower's problem bnot mine. my job is to lead. but yeah just like vacation i think leader abuse should also be banned. i didnt vacation until it was the only choice after all the kills and leader abuses. one abuse to a hundred whos going to win?

[Firetooth]

Leader abuse should be banned? What promi did you play? I'm guessing by leader abuse, you mean suiciding and missions? If that as banned, most (if not all) players with any experience would quit, unless everyone just indied and locked.
And one of guy's members did spy on watchtower, and as leader, that is your responsibility, as you are in charge of what your clan does. If your clan was doing things you didn't know about, were you really "the leader?"
Please add something in your post that justifies your arguements.